Forza 4 creative lead: game missing Porsches due to lack of access from EA
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Despite the inclusion of Porches in previous Forza Motorsport titles, Forza 4 won't feature any vehicles from the German sports car company. In a FAQ posted to the official Forza website, Turn 10 creative director Dan Greenwalt explained, "EA couldn't see their way towards collaborating again," though it seems that it wasn't for lack of trying on Turn 10's part. EA currently has licensing exclusivity arrangements with Porsche, similar to the publisher's deal with the NFL. With Need for Speed: Shift becoming its own sim racing franchise, it seems EA could be pushing back on the Forza folks.
"We've asked our contacts at EA to reconsider their position frequently and regularly over the last 18 months," Greenwalt said. "We also reached out to various influential people in gaming to lobby on our behalf, but that was to no avail." Though he said that his employer and EA have worked out sub-licensing deals before, this time EA wasn't on board -- regardless of how hard Turn 10 lobbied.
In total, the game will be lacking 35 Porsche models, replaced with an unnamed cadre of "new makes and models." Greenwalt's lament is palpable in his conclusion, where he apologized to series loyalists: "Fans shouldn't have to think about any of this -- you should just be able to drive Porsches and Ferraris in the games you love. Porsche makes wonderful cars and I'm sorry that we won't have them in Forza 4." EA had yet to respond to request for comment as of publishing.
"We've asked our contacts at EA to reconsider their position frequently and regularly over the last 18 months," Greenwalt said. "We also reached out to various influential people in gaming to lobby on our behalf, but that was to no avail." Though he said that his employer and EA have worked out sub-licensing deals before, this time EA wasn't on board -- regardless of how hard Turn 10 lobbied.
In total, the game will be lacking 35 Porsche models, replaced with an unnamed cadre of "new makes and models." Greenwalt's lament is palpable in his conclusion, where he apologized to series loyalists: "Fans shouldn't have to think about any of this -- you should just be able to drive Porsches and Ferraris in the games you love. Porsche makes wonderful cars and I'm sorry that we won't have them in Forza 4." EA had yet to respond to request for comment as of publishing.
Reader Comments (68)
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:01PM A Burger said
Definitive, indeed.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:42PM philmcfail said
@A Burger
I know you probably have a beef with A Sandwich, but trolling all the xbox related articles isn't gonna do anything.
Reply
I know you probably have a beef with A Sandwich, but trolling all the xbox related articles isn't gonna do anything.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:03PM TerryMasters said
Can't wait for Forza 5: Ford Edition after every game company in the world buys the exclusive rights to their own car company.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 3:37PM chrismdonahue said
@TerryMasters
It happened before, Need For Speed: Porsche Unleashed. It wasn't bad, not great. They were rumored to do the same with Lamborghini and Ferrari. There is also Outrun by Sega that has only Ferrari cars. There is the Ford Racing line of games as well.
Reply
It happened before, Need For Speed: Porsche Unleashed. It wasn't bad, not great. They were rumored to do the same with Lamborghini and Ferrari. There is also Outrun by Sega that has only Ferrari cars. There is the Ford Racing line of games as well.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 3:52PM Protege420 said
@TerryMasters
ahhem ahem...... YARIS anybody?
shutters gawd that was bad
Reply
ahhem ahem...... YARIS anybody?
shutters gawd that was bad
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:03PM sammo21 said
Oh well...Microsoft has stated they don't want games that were once exclusive to PS3 so why would Microsoft's gaming studio want cars once exclusive to EA?
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 2:52PM chrisredfield31 said
@sammo21 What are you talking about? It's Sony's policy in the first place. The only reason I know about this is because Sony told Namco Bandai that if their Tales game did not have any significant updates, they did not want it on their console.
The reason why this 'policy' (it's not even a real policy) even exists is because companies who once had Xbox 360 exclusives, were converting their releases to PS3 to make more money.
Reply
The reason why this 'policy' (it's not even a real policy) even exists is because companies who once had Xbox 360 exclusives, were converting their releases to PS3 to make more money.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 3:09PM mahouneko said
@chrisredfield31
I'm assuming that you guys are talking about this?
http://www.giantbomb.com/news/if-you-publish-on-psn-first-microsoft-aint-interested/3613/
The difference between PSN and XBLA is that PSN is willing to do business with you as long as is or if something special was added to it. XBLA, on the other hand, blacklists your product forever if you published on PSN first.
The other difference is that Sony's approach to exclusivity generally revolves around owning the IP itself. Any Indie game that uses support from the Indie Pub Fund is essentially surrendering the rights to their IP to Sony in exchange for access to the community dev fund.
Reply
I'm assuming that you guys are talking about this?
http://www.giantbomb.com/news/if-you-publish-on-psn-first-microsoft-aint-interested/3613/
The difference between PSN and XBLA is that PSN is willing to do business with you as long as is or if something special was added to it. XBLA, on the other hand, blacklists your product forever if you published on PSN first.
The other difference is that Sony's approach to exclusivity generally revolves around owning the IP itself. Any Indie game that uses support from the Indie Pub Fund is essentially surrendering the rights to their IP to Sony in exchange for access to the community dev fund.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:06PM foxhound said
I'm not really hurt over this. FORZA4 has so much else to offer and enjoy that I probably wouldn't care to use their manufacturer's cars anyway. Hell, I'm happy Turn-10 even offered a sincere apology over the matter. He could've just bitched openly about monopolizing a product line or sports league, but instead he took a much more mature approach.
Excuse me while I go pay off the remainder of my FORZA4 CE pre-order. :]
Excuse me while I go pay off the remainder of my FORZA4 CE pre-order. :]
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:08PM The Cole Train said
This is just a tad bit ridiculous.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:09PM arucious said
And now cars are going exclusive too -_-
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:16PM xiLeShadow said
@arucious
Soon guns will be exclusive as well...
Oh Please No. Or maybe? I don't know... It would force developers into making their own guns. =D
but that won't fit into the modern shooter genre.
I want my Fantasy Shooter fix =(
Reply
Soon guns will be exclusive as well...
Oh Please No. Or maybe? I don't know... It would force developers into making their own guns. =D
but that won't fit into the modern shooter genre.
I want my Fantasy Shooter fix =(
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:11PM slickriven42 said
Another reason nobody likes EA. I love driving numerous Porsches in F3... But I remember driving lots of Rufs in other games. Licensing agreements suck for the gamer.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 9:56PM This Little Man Says His Name Is said
@slickriven42
Forza 4 is going to have some RUFs in it.
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Forza 4 is going to have some RUFs in it.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 10:24PM slickriven42 said
@This Little Man Says His Name Is
That's good to hear and not surprising, only problem I see is that RUF didn't make LeManns class cars like the Flying Lizard 911s or the Class C monsters so F4 won't have those. Like others have said - 'Everyone loses'.
I'll still buy it and I'll still avoid EA products so oh well...
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That's good to hear and not surprising, only problem I see is that RUF didn't make LeManns class cars like the Flying Lizard 911s or the Class C monsters so F4 won't have those. Like others have said - 'Everyone loses'.
I'll still buy it and I'll still avoid EA products so oh well...
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:14PM Chris DPSN AggieCEO XBLThe Aggi said
well thats jacked up....
they could pull a GT5 and make tuned versions of them....well...SORT of tuned versions anyways
they could pull a GT5 and make tuned versions of them....well...SORT of tuned versions anyways
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:42PM SmilinGoat said
@Chris DPSN AggieCEO XBLThe Aggi
Forza 4 has RUF so it will have the tuned porches. this is what got everyones attention a few months ago, GT4/5 use RUF instead of porche for the same reasons Forza 4 will...
what i dont get is why porche would sign this shit, its free advertising. hell car companies PAY to be put in movies. execs need to learn a thing or two about video games.
Reply
Forza 4 has RUF so it will have the tuned porches. this is what got everyones attention a few months ago, GT4/5 use RUF instead of porche for the same reasons Forza 4 will...
what i dont get is why porche would sign this shit, its free advertising. hell car companies PAY to be put in movies. execs need to learn a thing or two about video games.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 6:49PM Fermie Prime said
@SmilinGoat That is my thought exactly. Why would Porsche limit their advertising and exposure to potential new customers who play video games. Simulation games like Forza and GT are amazing showcases of your car brand. Nothing but good things can come out this - brand loyalty, product excitement, word of mouth advertising. What a huge opportunity lost. There's no way EA is paying Porsche enough money to offset the potential revenue generated from manufactured customers who were converted after racing Porsches in a highly realistic and world-class experience. You nailed it - the Porsche exec who inked this deal doesn't have a clue
Reply
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 7:48PM Chareth Cutestory said
@SmilinGoat
"Free advertising" probably isn't worth much to a company like Porsche. I mean, how many people just decide to buy a Porsche? You'd either have to want one already, or to be in the minority of people who are crazily rich enough to buy a Porsche on a whim.
I'm assuming that EA paid Porsche more for the license exclusivity than Porsche would've gained from the advertising.
That said, I'm happy to hear about the RUF deal. When I saw this story, I was curious if Turn10 would take a page out of Polyphony's book in that respect, bypassing the Porsche license to some extent.
Reply
"Free advertising" probably isn't worth much to a company like Porsche. I mean, how many people just decide to buy a Porsche? You'd either have to want one already, or to be in the minority of people who are crazily rich enough to buy a Porsche on a whim.
I'm assuming that EA paid Porsche more for the license exclusivity than Porsche would've gained from the advertising.
That said, I'm happy to hear about the RUF deal. When I saw this story, I was curious if Turn10 would take a page out of Polyphony's book in that respect, bypassing the Porsche license to some extent.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 9:58PM This Little Man Says His Name Is said
@SmilinGoat
Turn 10 owns the exclusive rights to use Ferraris on 360 and PC so it's not just porsche.
Reply
Turn 10 owns the exclusive rights to use Ferraris on 360 and PC so it's not just porsche.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:14PM Prince David said
EA has hardly properly used this Porsche license. I loved NFS Porsche Unleashed but I'd rather see these cars in Gran Turismo and Forza than the floaty physics of SHIFT
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:14PM Frostfell said
It's too bad that Porsche will be missing, but Forza 4 has so much else to offer, I'm not too bothered by this news.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:16PM Cranky Penguin said
EA has owned Porsche rights forever, they even had a whole NFS game called Porsche Unleashed about 10 years ago. I'm surprised Forza ever had Porsche at all, I don't think GT ever has. I wish these kind of arrangements were illegal, we have all seen what EA does when they have a monopoly in an area.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:16PM Haon said
Maybe go the RUF route? They are classified as their own manufacturer I think. The problem with cars like 911s from porsche missing is that they are pretty unique with their engine layout and driving dynamics.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:21PM KevinWI said
It's not like Forza is completely innocent in this. Test Drive Unlimited 2 didn't have the Ferrari 458 in the Xbox 360 version because Forza and Microsoft have the exclusive rights to that car on their console.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:22PM Once known as Shadsy said
Nobody wins.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:27PM Gobertron said
As much as I hate EA and the way they treat customers, I have to regularly buy their games because there's no competition. FIFA is way better than Pes, no one else makes a game like madden & tiger woods. In any other industry one company wouldn't be able to hold such a large share of the rights or have such exclusivity.
It really does my head in, how you can buy a game like tiger woods, start a career mode and can't play every week on the calendar unless you buy extra courses at 800msp each.
Next they will only give you half the teams on madden, you have to download the rest or worse NFS arrives and your cars only have two wheels and half an engine.
It's a joke that we customers can't really choose to go else where!!!
It really does my head in, how you can buy a game like tiger woods, start a career mode and can't play every week on the calendar unless you buy extra courses at 800msp each.
Next they will only give you half the teams on madden, you have to download the rest or worse NFS arrives and your cars only have two wheels and half an engine.
It's a joke that we customers can't really choose to go else where!!!
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 2:47PM UnnXandros said
@Gobertron
Sorry to break this one to you, but yes u can!
Dont like EA, instead of Buying FIFA, buy PES, but as u stated FIFA owns PES these days.
instead of Buying Madden, buy Backbreaker.
MW3 - BF3
TopSpin 4 or VT4 - Grand Slam 2 or whatever their upcoming tennis game is.
So for almost every game there is a counterpart, except for maybe Tiger Woods.
Reply
Sorry to break this one to you, but yes u can!
Dont like EA, instead of Buying FIFA, buy PES, but as u stated FIFA owns PES these days.
instead of Buying Madden, buy Backbreaker.
MW3 - BF3
TopSpin 4 or VT4 - Grand Slam 2 or whatever their upcoming tennis game is.
So for almost every game there is a counterpart, except for maybe Tiger Woods.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:29PM Pure Black World Tendency said
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:34PM ima 747 said
This suckith mightily... game will still be great, but I will lament the lack of Porsches
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:35PM Captain Planet Planeteer Power said
EA hasn't made driving a Porsche fun since Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2. What a bunch of sissy pants.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:35PM EvilCartographer said
A racing game without a Porsche.
Thats a...............
..........
..............well, it's something, anyway.
Thats a...............
..........
..............well, it's something, anyway.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:50PM (Unverified) said
@EvilCartographer
Like bowling ball without a liquid center?
Reply
Like bowling ball without a liquid center?
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:40PM Maunder said
Never was a big fan of the Porches in the Forza series, but I know that alot of people are. I think this is actually a result of the success of video games. CEOs no longer need to worry as much about how thier fans feel because they know that they'll buy the games anyway. EA and Activision are just the worst ones.
Posted: Aug 25th 2011 1:56PM PointlessPuppies said
Quite the controversy when this issue came up in GT5. I know the ardent Gt5 haters used this to declare the entire game's failure, only for everyone else to realize that it didn't matter at all when the game actually came out.








