justchris

Wow, so many misunderstandings to clear up here.

No, you cannot use the Gamecube controller to control Rev gaves. They are only there for backwards compatibility, no other reason. And last I heard, Nintnedo said that was the only way to control GCN games, the shell controller will not control GCN games. However that's something that may change before the final release.

Secondly, the shell controller is exactly what one previous poster stated it is, damage control. It is there for developers to use in case they lack the mental fortitude to convert controls to the revmote. (For reference, I've yet to come across a single game idea that would work better using a dual shock than using the Revmote + Nunchuk).

The only object that has been referred to as a "dongle" so far is the attachment to add DVD movie playback. Up to this point, the controller attachments have been referred to as the following: Controller Attachments, Nunchuk, Controller Shell
Nintendo has never mentioned the term "dongle" in relation to the controller.

In Super Monkey Ball, the main game, you actually controlled the ground, not the space-age-polymer balls containing poor, put upon monkies. In the mini-games, however, the monkies got their revenge by spontanenously disobeying the laws of physics (don't believe me, look closely in monkey golf or monkey bowling, the monkies make movements INSIDE the ball with a golf club, and the ball goes flying...that's just not right) and you control the balls themselves, not the landscape.

They look like Xbox graphics because this game started development on the PS1, switched to GC development, then went over to 360 development. They've had to rework the art assets multiple times.

The only game I've played by Silicon Knights was Eternal Darkness, which was lots of fun. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, since they've obviously put a lot of work into Too Human (although I agree their original idea for it sounded much cooler).

I still think it would have played better with the Revmote (especially since they're taking out player control of the camera).

Lee, think of how you would control an FPS with a mouse.

First of all, you don't move your arm, that'll just tire you out. All you have to do is turn your wrist, and when the Revmote is pointing at the edge of the screen, there's a slight delay, after which you start turning around. As long as you keep pointing at the edge of the screen YOU WILL KEEP TURNING AROUND. To stop turning, you stop pointing at the edge of the screen. This is exactly the way it works on a pc with a mouse to turn, so you don't have to worry about your target being somewhere other than where the Revmote is pointing.

Everything I've said in this post is purely my assumptions, not verified fact. I assume it works this way because it's a control method that's know to work on every PC FPS ever. I can't see any reason they'd reinvent the wheel on this one.

It's entirely possible the Rev could use both the sensors and gryos, however, it does not require gyros to sense rotation.

The sensor bar has two sensors, one at either end. If the Revmote were set up so that it had 3 transmitters in it in a triangular setup on a single plane, constantly emitting a 1 bit "Here I am signal." The revolution will always know the position of the controller. If all 3 transmitters move in one direction, it's linear movement, if only one moves, or 2 move, it's angular movement, and depending on which sensors move, you can mathematically, determine the degree and type of tilt (pitch, yaw or roll).

This has several advantages over gyros. Gryos have moving parts which can become disaligned if the controller gets thrown against a wall (I suspect after getting shot full of holes the 12th time this will happen with more than one controller). Also, if gyros were used to detect the angular movement of the controller, all that information would then have to be transmitted to the sensor bar, and then to the revolution from there. If you use static sensors constantly emitting a "Here I Am" signal, that's 1 bit each, for a total of 3 bits, information directly picked up by the sensor bar and transmitted to the revolution, where the processor can figure all the necessary transformations and physics calculations out in the span of maybe 10 processor calculations (understanding that MHz measures millions of calculations per second), which is less time than it takes to load a texture out of RAM.

This doesn't mean it doesn't use gyros, just that it seems unlikely they'd bother to use them, at least for the detection of movement. It might use gyros and such for a more advanced rumble effect.

The reason the name Revolution will not stay is pretty simple, from a marketing/mind share standpoint.

The biggest mistake Nintendo ever made was naming the 4th Nintendo system the Gamecube. Think about it. What did we call their first system? "The Nintendo". The second system? "The Super Nintendo". The 3rd system? "Nintendo 64". The 4th System? "The Gamecube." No one ever actually calls it "The Nintendo Gamecube", it's always just the Gamecube. Nintendo's brand is "Nintendo". If they keep the name Revolution, it will always be referred to as Revolution. One of the reasons for my predicting Experience is that, not only is it a marketable idea, but no one is ever going to call the console, "The Experience". You sound like an idiot, so they'll go back to calling it "The Nintendo" when speaking to their friends. The abbreviation for it can be NXP, NEX, or NExp. The main point is, when you're talking to your friends, Nintendo want's you asking them if they're going to get the New Nintendo, not the Revolution. Revolution would just be one generation of gaming, Nintendo is forever.

I predict the new name will be The Nintendo Experience.

I stopped reading after about 12 comments, I just had to say this. Sony has said they will be releasing 1 million consoles a month PER REGION. That means 1 million in the US, 1 million in Japan & 1 million Europe. So yes, there is no way that Gamestop is going to get 1.2 million of the 2 million total units Sony expects to ship to the US this year.

Nintendo, on the other hand, has not said anything at all about their expected production or shipment. They may have spoken with gamestop privately, but I just can't imagine Nintendo's marketing department would let them ship less than a million consoles to the US on release when they already KNOW that Sony is shipping a million consoles. I mean, Sony told the entire world their plan. It would be a tad naive of Nintendo not to at least try to match Sony, if only so they can point to equal shipping numbers in their marketing reports.

I went with 8-bit on this one. BM's reaction in the last panel was perfect. Now that's comedic timing.

My second vote would be CAD, though.

Perhaps I should clarify my stance a little.

Functionally, the Revmote alone (assuming appropriate level of precision) is little different from a standard controller. You have approximately the same number of input options.

The primary difference is that the Revmote is more transparent than current controllers. It is based on moving your arm and wrist, movements which every person alive has done from birth, and which most of us do every day.

Using a "standard" controller, is an abnormal learned behavior. A behavior that less than 10% of the world's population has bothered to learn.

For experienced gamers like ourselves, using the revmote will not really be any easier or any harder than using a standard controller, or a keyboard and mouse for that matter. Nor will it offer less functionality, in fact it potentially offers more functionality, but for most games, it will offer the same functionality that you'd have with a standard controller.

That means that the only thing that matters is the games. Games that are normally reserved for the hardest of hardcore markets, that are so complex in controls that they require every advance current controllers have to offer, will no longer be limited to people who can master a current controller. Anyone will be able to play them, because using the controller itself will be more than just easy, it'll be completely natural.

The shell controller is a cop-out. There is no game
that cannot be controlled with the Revmote & nunchuk. There are some games, like driving or sports games, for instance, that would benefit from a different add-on to make their control even more transparent. But that does not make them any less playable with the standard setup. There is no genre that actually requires the controller shell, at least, not of any of the existing genre's. As for new genre's, well, we'll need to wait and see.

The only existing issues are: Will the controller be precise enough to meet it's promise?

Will developers make proper use of the controller? Some developers seem to "get it". They realize it's not about mapping every possible action to movement. It's about a more natural, transparent way to control, about making the controller disappear so the game becomes the focus. That is something that will NEVER be possible with a standard controller. It only feels that way to us because we've been gaming for 21 years (well, I have), we've gotten used to it. For anyone who's never gamed, who just started, or stopped years ago, this new control system will be intuitive, natural, invisible. That's the idea.

Sedeas, read LaughingTarget's comment first. Got that? Good. Now, consider that not one thing Nintendo has ever put in a controller was created by them.

The D-Pad? Games used control pads before the NES, it just wasn't standard.

Shoulder buttons? It was used before as well.

Analog joystick? At least two consoles used Analog Joysticks before the SNES even came out.

Touch Screens? Like you said, PDAs have had them for yeas.

Trigger buttons? Used on every light Gun game in every arcade, ever.

Voice Commands? Used in pc games for years as well.

Rumble Pack? The idea of force feedback was around long before the n64 as well.

The simple fact of the matter is, Nintendo has never created any of these ideas. They didn't create motion sensitivity either. On the other hand, every controller Nintendo has ever made has be of excellent quality. There's some differences in preference, some prefer the Dual Shock to the Wavebird, some preferred Genesis controllers to the SNES controllers, but that doesn't change the fact that Nintendo still, by and large, makes the best controllers out there.

Nintendo doesn't create these ideas, they make games, and then decide what ideas will work better with games. It's what they've always done. They went with a control pad instead of a control stick with the NES because it worked better with the games they designed. They added shoulder buttons because it worked better with the games they designed. They added an analog stick because it worked better with the games they designed. This is not something they've only been doing for 10 years, it's something they've been doing since they started into the video game business back in 1983. Design game, figure out best way to control it, perfect controller.

NINTENDO DOES NOT MAKE BAD CONTROLLERS. Even the virtual boy had an excellent controller, it was just the rest of it that kinda sucked. So if you wonder why people are willing to ignore the obvious pitfalls and instead imagine the possibilities, it's because, whatever other flaws they may have, Nintendo's controllers are always top notch.

So, rather than criticizing them for their choice, take a few moments to imagine a controller that can accurately detect angular or linear movements to within 1 degree of position wold allow you, as a game developer, to do. Because I assure you, any problems you can conceive with the controls, Nintendo has already thought of, and I doubt they'd release it if it weren't ready.