Gamasutra examines a PlayStation brand in crisis

@Doctor Who
"I give Sony props for at least trying to get this all sorted out as soon as possible"

... as opposed to what ??

@(Unverified)

As opposed to taking an unforgiveable amount of time to get everything back up

@Doctor Who

Forgot to add: here's looking at you Microsoft with your RROD

@Doctor Who
You're giving props for "trying"?! The least they can do is to successfully restore service fix, let alone "try". Their "tries" to secure their system by removing Other OS got them to this point in the first place.

To those saying it isn't sony's fault. Oh, it is. Kinda. Why hasn't amazon been hacked? Or XBL? How about steam? PayPal? iTunes?

None of them have been breached in the way sony's psn has been. This is a big problem, and it's THEIR fault for not protecting OUR information with which we trusted them.

Yes, the hackers are to blame, but so is sony! They just now hired security experts. May I ask why just now?

@Doctor Who said "Forgot to add: here's looking at you Microsoft with your RROD"

Wow, seriously? You're going to dive straight down the console war hole, huh?

Microsoft took my dead xbox back and sent me a new one at their expense for their manufacturing carelessness. At the very least, Sony can offer to reimburse me for my credit reports due to the casual manner in which they handled the security of my data.

(and as an aside, I suspect if I come back later and find this comment downvoted, that means an overwhelming majority of PS3 gamers visiting this site are not old enough to old credit cards.)

@(Unverified)

Is one not allowed to at least try to support them?

@Doctor Who

I think my comments are coming off differently than I intended them too

@Lucky48 I would think because you have to pay, hacking XBL would be more desirable and would have happened first

@Vuvuzelas It did, back in 2007. It's just Sony got it a lot harder than MS did, but they still get it today, Employee's account have been hacked. Along with Itunes and about every other major corporation you can think of. But Clearly this is a Sony problem "rolls eyes".

@Lucky48 how doesn't that make sense?

but I was thinking more along the lines of making it free or something

@Doctor Who

You're saying that Sony did better than MS handling of the RROD? MS extended warranties to ensure that their mess got cleaned up. Yeah it sucked but the actively did something about it. I'm waiting for Sony to actually do something before I say "at least they did something".

@DarkSan00

Those companies haven't had a well publicized court battle with a hacker. It's this geohot incident that has put Sony under the magnifying glass of high profile hackers.

If you run into a crazy person with a gun, you don't tell them you're going to take the gun away because that might make them use it.

@DarkSan00

No, the hackers don't have it out for Sony at all. Sorry about that. You're right.

@Integral

Didn't MS face a class action law suit before they even acknowledged the RROD problem?

@Doctor Who

Microsoft looks back with a 'Disc Read Error' on a screen

@mmmfishtacos
Tricking an underpaid worker to reveal an account's information is not exactly the same now is it?

With the right information any network can be hacked but let's not call apples, elephants.

The fact is Sony did not encrypt the user data like they did the credit card into. I don't think it requires lynching Sony for it but it's a breach of trust, so don't give them a free pass, unless you think that it doing everything includes identity theft in which case well you signed on the dotted line.

@BigEgo007

Yes, CAL was pending. Sony, on the other hand, had to lose a CAL over the PS2 before they would repair consoles with the infamous 'Disc Read Error'

@BigEgo007

I think your timeline's correct. MS didn't extend the warranty out of the goodness of their heart. It could be the class action lawsuit or the publicity of it but they DID make it right. And they're posting record profits.

Imagine that? Huh? Take care of the consumers and they're rewarded? It would have taken a marketing genious to figure this one out. Sony can turn this debacle into a PR win.........but will they? MS dragged their feet on tthe RROD too so there's still time.

@Integral Did everyone forget that MS dragged their feet on that issue, they tired to pass it off as negligent on the consumer end., talking about dusty systems. it was more than a year before that admitted anything, it was only till they realized they would have to recall and refund everyone before they made the billion dollar move to extend the warranty. They also didn't repair the E74 failures under the 3 year warranty, not to mention scratched disk, then they acted as tho people where dancing around their living room holding the box. Really? Where was the shit talking post about MS joystiq? A few jokes and thats about it. like they did nothing wrong, they rush to market to beat Sony hoping it would give them the upper hand, how well did that work for them? I really hate to get in to this whole fanboy war, but what the hell? Really! This is just beyond out of hand, as long as no harm was done to your credit card or bank account, then no foul. You can still play most of your games while PSN is down, so get over it.

@Doctor Who

Sorry but who owned the user database? Sony, who had the responsibility to ensure said user database was secure? Sony. Who was responsible to ensure that if the Sony network were to be compromised in anyway that measures were taken to ensure said user database content wasn't exposed in the clear? Sony. You are correct in saying that any system can be hacked but you need to place fail safe measures to ensure the data is protected and Sony didn't even bother to encrypt the damn database. How is this not their fault again, do enlighten me? I can say this as I work in Network and Data Security and basic data encryption should have been a no brainer and can't simply be written off as an oh ish...mah bad.

Those who say we should blame Sony for the lack of security instead of blaming the hackers and that's it's Sony's fault that there's a hack, by your logic, then we should blame the USA for the lack of airport security and it's USA's fault for 9/11 instead of blaming Al-Qaeda.

That's a stupid logic.

@DarkSan00

Amazon has been hacked: MafiaBoy (February 2000). Google it.

@mmmfishtacos

MS didn't have 70million 360s RRD in one day.

@onan '

He raises a valid point on the 360 RRODs..

A 30% failure rate and how does the gaming industry reward them? By buying 2-3 360's so they can have backups when it fails. I applaud Microsoft for eventually doing something about it (I don't think they have a 2 week turn around time) but where was Joystiq in this "we as gamers need to do something about this"?

Microsoft cleaned up their act but people were not all hate and rage filled over buying a poorly designed $400 console nor did you, Joystiq, ask us to teach Microsoft a lesson. Why ask us this now? Why not ask Facebook to do the same when their game developers leaked/sold our personal information?

I think you know the answer but I want to hear you say it.

@ToTheMoon CAUSE THEY ARE JAPANEEEESEEE

@DarkSan00 There are security teams for all networks, the security experts were called in just now because they are the ones who are trying to find out where the hackers went in the network and help see how they got it. It's not just like opening a door and saying, OH that's where they went. A good hacker, tries to leave as little information about there where abouts on a network. That's one of the reasons it's probably taking longer than usual to get the network back up too, I bet Sony wants those hackers bad, especially now with the FBI and Home Land Security looking into it with them.

And yes, Amazon, XBL etc haven't been hacked but you can NEVER rule out the possibility. If we ran on those ideals, that since something has never happened or proven wrong we'd all still think the world was flat and everything else revolved around the earth.

Dealing with information on the internet is ALWAYS a risk and its' as much our fault to put that information out there and not properly monitor it/be secure with it.

Also, a year back, hackers were able to get into Major Nelsons XBL account to prove a point that even they are not impervious to them.

http://www.next-gen.biz/news/major-nelson-xbox-live-account-hacked

http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/933/933332p1.html

Shit happens, and it's infuriating that the hackers thus far have gotten away with it. And Sony, while having security and seeming to be standard from what all the investigation has shown so far, could have done better with their PR side in letting people know faster and obviously having a bit stronger of a security. But I bet that won't happen again with them after an incident like this.

All this has done for me personally is, not lose faith in Sony but hate hackers even more and realize that using my credit card for almost everything puts me at major risk.

@DarkSan00 actually security breaches happen on Xbox Live quite often. Even the accounts of their major executives have been hacked multiple times.

In any case, just another rather trashy article trying to build on the controversy of the anti-Sony witch hunt.

@DarkSan00
"To those saying it isn't sony's fault. Oh, it is. Kinda. Why hasn't amazon been hacked? Or XBL? How about steam? PayPal? iTunes?

(im on a phone so grammar is gonna be a off) are you serious dude the terms and conditions guy on xbl had his own account hacked on his personal information used it was even an article go back about a week its there and i know people who have had there xbl hacked and dumb asses used the credit card info from my friends account to pay for his own xbl membership thats how the caught him. and amazon, itunes, and paypal are hacked all the time are you kidding me banks have been attacked... also out of all the nexgens sony was the last to have a homebrew out there Wii and Xbox where both crcked right out the gate, why do you think it was such a big deal when it happened to sony. and lets give sony a lil cred here they are the only company out of the nexgens willing to stand up to hackers and this is by far the biggest hacker attack in reference to the video game community, and possibly one of the largest it was all over the news. they have had security experets they just established a new team. and they got scared by an atemp at serious damage there doing this to further protect the gamer.

@onan
"(and as an aside, I suspect if I come back later and find this comment downvoted, that means an overwhelming majority of PS3 gamers visiting this site are not old enough to old credit cards.) "

(on mobile grammar will be off)
please put master chief down so you can pay attention to what im about to tell you all of xbox marketing is geared toward children most all of your bundels in giant retail stores come with kung fu pand, some type of lego game, or kinectamals, wyll sony is infamous, drakes, socom, killzone, and yes 1 lego batman. your avatar is a cartoon sony's gives you a picture and then gives you home. need i go on...yes you pay to get the same s*** i get for free and sont gives you tons more the largest downloaded game of all time (angry birds) you didn't get (not sayin anyone wanted it) i only play on my 360 gears of war and cod only beacuse some of my friends don't have a ps3. lets not forget the top seat for halo multiplayer was held by an 8 yo for a time, or halo odst (obviusly developers stop trying) yes i pick on halo alot dont comment me back saying how much it is awesome or how bout fact 360 can't properly produce 1080p the point of having a nexgen is for it to be a nexgen not a small step from the last one which i was horribly let down when i bought my 360. xbox has sent me myn back twice when it broke down, and then replaced the third time while as for sony my original last all the way till the slim which i then gave myn to a good friend of myn and bought the slim which i was upset when my touch buttons were gone small price to pay. i put on kinectamls for my 14 month old and she has a ball try giving a child the move and see what happens my woman always ask why i got the kinect when i love the sharp shot for the move can you say superiour yes you may sony also has 2 gunny actors on thier comercials when all xbox does is pay for air time with game clips with a big xbox sign at the end when almost all of the time its fro both sytems. weres all that xbl money going ms when even your terms and conditions people get hacked and your comericals are pointless its not to your ms games cause there craptastic

@Doctor Who Haha reach way in your box. Lets remember MS replaced that old box. They tend to do right by customers where Sony acts like we owe them something.

@This Little Man Says No their attack against their own consumers was a slow one, that last years. So you really think that is better than some hacker getting 77 million addresses and names? Hell i guess you hate the yellow pages and Facebook too.

@Doctor Who "no system in the world is impenetrable"

True. But according to reports in the hacking community who had peaked in at PSN servers themselves, months AFTER the PS3 got jailbroken, and months BEFORE PSN got 'intruded' upon, Sony's security was weak and outdated to the point that not only should it have come up in quarterly meetings at Sony years ago, but definitely should have been updated and/or overhauled following the PS3 jailbreak - and it simply was not.

http://gamersrepublic.net/topic/23169-cause-of-psn-service-interruption-external-intrusion/page__view__findpost__p__244741

I don't know what planet you come from, but here on Earth that is known as gross negligence on Sony's part. And morally, ethically, and legally (here in the US, and across most of Europe) they need to be held accountable for this debacle.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying, "don't go after the hackers." But the FBI (and likely several other police agencies) is already on that, and the hackers will likely be found and punished.

At the same time for proffering up such a weak state of security first for the PS3 (which they left the keys just sitting right there in the system), and then especially for the outdated state of PSN security (which did not even bother to hash and encrypt our private, personal data), Sony is just as accountable as the hackers for this mess. And as videogame consumers, if we are either too chickenshit, too apathetci, or too much of brown-nosing fanboys to put our collective foots down and say, "never again," not from Sony, not from Microsoft, not from ANYONE, then we deserve to have our data stolen and worse, anytime some hacker decides they want to take it from a game company.

Whether we like it or not, we are all in this together. And if we do not stand together, we will fall together. And that's the way it works. The days of fanboys blindly defending multi-billion corporations too happy to take our money, but otherwise could give a rat's ass about any of us, and apathetic gamers, really needs to come to an end.

@Integral
"MS extended warranties to ensure that their mess got cleaned up. Yeah it sucked but the actively did something about it. I'm waiting for Sony to actually do something before I say "at least they did something". "

Yeah, Sony should follow in Microsoft's footsteps on that one and wait over 2 years to admit anything went wrong.

@soloassassin Jesus Christ, dude, calm down. Rant unnecessary.

All I was saying is that this issue is way too large for partisan console fanboyism to be a factor, and made an offhand conditional statement based on vote outcome. It ended up upvoted because most people who had a credit card on Sony's system agree regardless of fanboy tendencies that this situation is REALLY messed up and they hate the fact their info got stolen and think 6 days with no notification is unacceptable.

Getting offended enough to go off on a defensive rant based on that shows a complete lack of faith in Playstation gamers and speaks more to your preconceptions than mine.

Ultimately we weren't disagreeing (unless you're ok with your CC and personal info being stolen due to lax security).

As far as the bundle rant and whatever else was in there: I have my systems, I play my games, I couldn't care less who they market to as long as I get games I enjoy playing. Kinectimals existing doesn't make me enjoy Portal 2 or Mortal Kombat any less. But hey, if it means it puts a smile on your 14 month-old daughter's face, I'm glad it's out there. (Congratulations, btw.)

@Ballistic H

No, that isn't the same at all, actually. Airport security wasn't at the standard it is today, before 9/11 because at that point, the methods the Terrorists used were really unanticipated. Airplane highjacking in the U.S. was really a non-issue.

Hacking on the other hand, is very popular and to be expected, and when you're dealing with a network that large, that has a user database with that much personal information, it'd be foolish to not have fail-safes in place to prevent the compromising of user data on such a large scale.

Sony really showed just how ignorant they can be in matters of networking, and security. Not to mention, the way they handle the situation after the fact.

@Doctor Who They DIDN'T sort it out as fast as possible. Instead, they attempted to keep a lid on it. Also, they may not be able to create a 100% safe system, but not even encrypting millions of profiles containing private data is unforgivable.

@Integral

MS didnt offer free repairs off the bat. And never have for any errors except the one. They denied and denied that they took shortcuts in the manufactoring process of the 360.

It took one customer taking his machine to a electronics repair store, and opening it up.

They found and proved that MS purposely installed a heatsink almost 1/2" the size it should have been. This was because they messed up with the case design and the proper heat sink would not fit. They were scared Sony was releasing the PS3 and did not want to be last to show.

They were fully 100% responsible for this negligent fault and this was proven and they got sued for 5 million dollars from that one customer.
They would have lost that case and this is a fact. This would represent a total loss for MS of 5 million dollars per client.

Now 5 million dollars multiplied by the approximately 30 million customers would have put MS completely out of business and bankrupt them. Or do you think MS has 150 000 000 000 000 dollars to give out in lawsuits? Thats 150 trillion dollars, no company has that.

They settled out of court by extending the warrenty by 3yrs, estimates calculated the maximum loss from this extension was around 1 billion dollars and this would not bankrupt MS.

Which would you choose? Pay 150 trillion and go on unemployment or make an offer that at most would cost you 0.0006666% of that?

They had to do it, they had absolutely no choice what-so-ever.

But everyone thinks MS is some kind of touchy feely lovin carebare company that would do anything for their customers because of this thing they were forced to do, LOL.

Companies love money, not you, try not to forget this.

@Tachyonic Cargo Well said. Obviously you are a grownup and not some fanboy child like so many other posters on this forum. Anyone actually defending Sony is underaged and still in elementary school, if not... please leave your mother's basement and become part of the real world.

Anyone attempting to compare Sony's situation to a hardware failure has lost touch with reality and has a clear agenda. These people have to be children who parents personal info was lost. Something they obviously could care less about. Generation Etitled strikes again.

@Ballistic H

It isn't anything like that. It is correct to blame the US Government in that situation. Their primary role in the country is to protect it's citizens and they failed. When I screw up at work I am reprimanded and I'm not allowed to blame the cause of my screw up. We are all to be held responsible for our mistakes and shortcomings. They took up the responsibility of protecting consumer information when they decided to participate in the digital economy.

@Mr Hett

* "...stop and whine..."

@Mr Hett

Im with you man. I like what I get from sony. This article makes it seem like Playstation is in its death throes. Its not. It was the last of the current gens to come out and is still holding its own in the market. So far this year its outselling all other brands (for consoles, of course) so I would say this is a GOOD sign for sony, hardly a bad one.

Will this hacker thing be bad news? Currently yes. But I trust a place that has been broken into and had to beef up its security over those that dont know where they are weakest yet. That means good news, not bad. Plus the line up of games still coming out this year has me hook.

Im a sony fan, but with good reasons.

@Mr Hett

Seems to be the popular thing to do.

@Mr Hett

I have purchased every single video game console that Sony has produced with the exception of the PSP Go, but for me, enough is enough. And that's not to say that I don't like the systems or the games, because I do, but until the bigwigs at Sony start treating their customers more like human beings and less like morons that they deign to sell stuff to, I'm out. Now, don't get me wrong, I know that Microsoft and Nintendo don't really care about me as a person, but at least their contempt isn't so in-my-face all the time. If this same thing happened to Nintendo then you'd better believe that there would be information being mailed to your house in every way possible and you wouldn't be able to turn on a talk show without hearing from Reggie. Microsoft would give everyone free Live and XBLA games and Major Nelson would be leading a media blitzkrieg. They wouldn't be hiding and telling you to fix the f*cking problem yourself. Sony has made it very clear recently that they aren't willing to engage in meaningful dialogue with their customers, and the sad thing is that's not what got them where they are today. They just want you to shut up, get a second job and buy another God of War game.

When I was a kid, I would have done exactly that, but I'm an adult now. If Sony wants to tell me to f*ck off and fix my own problems then fine. I have other options and it's not like I even have time to play all the games on 360 and Wii that I want to. Uncharted and inFamous were amazing but they'll have multi-plat 3D HHD Collector's Edition remakes in a few years anyway so I'll pick them up then. Fire that jackass Tretton and get someone sane at the helm, Sony. Then we can talk. As it is, I can't hear myself think over the sound of Tretton mentally fellating himself.

@Cavall

"So far this year its outselling all other brands (for consoles, of course) so I would say this is a GOOD sign for sony, hardly a bad one."

Ok, reality check.
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/04/29/xbox-360-sees-record-fiscal-q3-sales-kinect-sold-2-4m-units-in/

Link please to your claim.

@Mr Hett - It's not just video games at this point: It is your name, address, phone number, security questions and answers, date of birth, e-mail address, password, and potentially your credit card info.

This isn't about video games as much as it is about information security in an age where companies are asking for way more data than they need, and then storing it in with wanton abandon for security.