Report: Used and digital sales make up 35% of total console spending in the US

@Master Troll Everyone ends up at Taco Bell after 12 am.

@DJ Kenneth A Let me know when the console pricing model for digitals catches up with Steam's.

@Faceless Troll And that is the downside :( Steam is unbeatable with that.

@DJ Kenneth A
The main reason I don't go digital is there is no guarantee they will keep giving me the game I purchased. Seems like all retailers aside steam have some clause in their EULA where inactivity causes the account to close, or you can only download the game 5 times, or you have to have persistent internet.
Well, I guess that's a ton of money saved.

@Peffse

Always slightly worried about that moment. It's a bit awkward when consoles can't even back up this data to any physical media as of yet.

@Peffse Those are good reasons. For me it works with the Go since I use PSN a lot, and it's easy to take that to work rather then dragging a ton of games with me.

I think a big push towards digital is coming from the Smart Phone world too. So many arguments for and against digital. It's like anything else in the long run, it has it's ups and downs.

@DJ Kenneth A

I used to think digital games were a great idea, but after the traveshamockeries that online passes and season passes have been I don't trust console devs with it.

Seems all the console devs are playing a big game of "who can d**k over the consumer the most and get away with it". I don't want to give them another vehicle for that.

@DJ Kenneth A
Consoles will only take up a fully digital MP3 business model when we can get all our games for free just like music. Seriously the only reason why MP3s became so popular is BECAUSE of the ease of piracy and how little value is placed on music. It's played for free on the radio, on tv and on youtube if you have the ability to record sound you NEVER have to buy another cd as long as you live. Videogames will never be that easy because they're worth more in some cases than blockbuster movies.

@xiLeShadow To be fair, you would have never bought those indy games, even at say a dollar or two a title, if you were in a retail environment. The same with Steam Sales. If you had to get off your ass to go to a store to purchase these games, even at the same price, you probably would not.

I like physical games too much to get into digital copies, even when they become incredibly cheap on Steam.

@Giovanni117

Spaces kill.

@Meekermoloko

Old argument is old. The used market is bad for the industry, plain and simple, and comparisons to other consumables don't really fit. However, the used market is forcing publishers to rethink their distribution and pricing so I guess it can be seen as a positive. They have gone unchallenged for far too long.

@GrandpaMasaki Old argument is old. Nobody has ever given a good explanation why video games are magically different from every other industry in existence.

@Faceless Troll

I have, many times. But no one ever listens. It's not just that they are different than any other industry, but all these industries are different. I don't think it really makes any sense to compare a car to a book, or a dvd to an article of clothing. That just seems nonsensical to me.

People like to compare video games to cars, for instance, but are they really comparable? A car is not a purchase an individual makes several times a year, and it is a purchase that comes with a fluctuating level of risk when purchased used. It is also not consumed in 20 to 30 hours and then put aside...it's not generally purchased as a form of entertainment...

What about books? Well, isn't print getting hammered in the digital age? Also, the differences in development costs are astronomical, I mean, should we really even be comparing the two? How many people does it take to make a single AAA video game? How many people does it take to write one book? When you walk in to a Barnes and Noble, are used copies of new releases being sold for a few dollars cheaper right next to the new copies? And isn't digital distribution through e-readers and the like a form of combating the used market?

Look, I could go on and on, but the point is that just saying "I can buy this item used, why you cry Activision?" is naive and shows a lack of reflection. I think if people thought about it a bit more they might understand that this reasoning is false. Does that mean that developers are completely devoid of responsibility? Of course not, I've said it many times, but it doesn't mean that they should just let themselves get trampled by the second hand market.

@GrandpaMasaki

The idea that they're "losing" money from used sales is nonsensical, because it assumes that the person buying used would have bought it new if there were no other alternatives. For the thousands of people who wait until a game is $20 in the bargain bin, this reasoning is clearly wrong.

Then there's people like me, I buy a lot of new games, but if I couldn't trade in old games to mitigate the costs, I'd be buying a lot less than I do now. To date nobody has managed to actually quantify how used games is supposedly harming the industry without pulling some numbers out of their ass based on a "best guess" and fuzzy math.

Companies like EA can CLAIM their sales are down because of used games, but I doubt that's really the case. The fact that plenty of companies are thriving despite the used market runs counter to this.

@Faceless Troll

Look, we clearly don't agree on this, and these discussions hardly end well, especially here. I'd just like to point out that you're immediately jumping to an extreme here. There's a very real difference between $20 and $55, or $50 or even $45. Most used games are being sold for a few dollars cheaper than new, they don't come with 50% to 75% price cuts. Used games do not really lose any value against new games, because they are essentially the same thing, and that is part of the problem. If the consumer can save $5 or $10 on the exact same product, then the consumer is going to do that. Look, a difference of $5 to $10 should not be ruining your budget, and if it is, well...I don't know, get a new job? I work for freaking minimum wage and I manage to support my hobby just fine. I really do believe that if the consumer did not have a choice, they would fork out the extra $10 to $20 as opposed to just not buying the game at all.

I agree, trading in games is nice and allows you to buy even more games, and without this many people would be buying less games. But it doesn't seem like the used market is really helping push the sale of new games, so in the end developers still aren't seeing that money. An individual that buys used, trades in, then buys used again...well, that person doesn't even really exist to the developers, so what do they care if he buys less games? Sure, not everyone is doing this, some are using the sale of used games to fund the purchase of new games, but people are cheap, and that is not the cheapest route. As a general rule I believe people will do what is easiest and cheapest, whatever their income level.

I keep saying that games are too expensive, and that it's ridiculous that all games be priced the same. This is a fact, and the industry needs to get it together. The used market is helping to change this, but it does not excuse it of any and all wrongdoing, and I understand why publishers are fighting against it.

Look, neither of us have any numbers to quantify what we're saying, so I don't buy that argument either. Why does your saying that I don't have numbers negate my opinion, when you don't either? This line of reasoning simply makes sense to me. When you buy used from Gamestop or Amazon or wherever you want to buy from, you are not dealing with the publisher at all. You are not a Blizzard customer, or an EA customer, or whatever. You are a Gamestop or Amazon Marketplace or eBay customer. And if less people are buying new, then it makes sense for retail outlets to order less copies, resulting in fewer new sales and less money for publishers/developers.

@GrandpaMasaki

"You are not a Blizzard customer, or an EA customer, or whatever. You are a Gamestop or Amazon Marketplace or eBay customer."

Oh please. How do you think Gamestop gets their "new" copies? Oh yeah, they pay the distributors for them. So when you purchase new games at Gamestop? You're still not an EA customer. You're a Gamestop customer whether you buy them new or used. Try being less dishonest.

@GrandpaMasaki
I can't beleive people still hold on to this argument. If a person chose to buy a game as used, or buy it from a friend or even pirate it, they would never have bothered to buy it new. That they buy a used game at 10% off the price at gamestop simply means they're poor consumers to begin with since they more often than not can get it for less if they search around more. In fact the smarter consumer will WAIT for the price of the majority of games to drop below what a used game would cost. 1. because not all games are must haves at a brand new price and 2. because so many games are released that many people dont even finish the game they bought before. If they waited, finished the game they were playing and then bought a new game no one would ever buy the majority of games at full price and the industry would see a huge noticeable dip.

Do you complain at that point that the people waiting for a price drop are somehow stealing from the publishers or ripping them off? No because it's simply supply and demand. It's a bad argument and smacks of desperation to justify a position that logical can't be defended without forcing your own version of reality into the argument.

@Meekermoloko Do you buy used car every week?

@GrandpaMasaki And then you started implying that buying used is unethical.

And I thought of libraries and the public interest.

I'll stop laughing at some point.

@PN04

This. This is why I hate our community. I write giant blocks of text explaining my position, but no one reads it. They just hear what they want to hear, and respond accordingly.

I never said we need to get rid of the used game market, and I make it a point in EVERY POST to say that the pricing of video games needs to be restructured.

Look, at the end of the day, I don't think used games are pushing down the price of games, it's the lightning deals, the buy one get one and all that. The used game market is out of control and needs to be reigned it, it is absolutely ridiculous that they can undermine the price of a new game by a couple of dollars the way they do. No other used market works the same way, and if you think it does...well you're lying to yourself.

I would rather have publishers add on things like online passes or additional content for those who buy new as opposed to taking content out of a retail release and pushing it two, or three months later as DLC. All your complaining and defending the used market is not going to change the fact that these people need to make money. Reward your loyal customers and punish those that are trying to cheat you, I'm fine with that. Unfortunately the trend lately has been to release incomplete games and then profit through DLC that can not be traded or sold used. If that's what you really want for this industry then be my guest.

@GrandpaMasaki
I, for one, fully agree with what you are saying. I've made the same exact arguments myself on here. Few people listen. They want to come up with all sorts of crazy explanations to justify the used market and paint developers and publishers as greedy and evil for wanting consumers to pay for their product. An the nonsensical comparisons to used cars (and other items that DEGRADE with use) are inevitable.

The big argument that people who buy used would NEVER buy the same game new is just as false as the argument that a pirate would NEVER buy a game they just stole. If someone buys used or downloads an illegal copy, they just demonstrated without a doubt that they wanted the game. Period. Proving that they wouldn't obtain it legally, for full price is an uphill battle. Not the other way around.j

The used game market generates BILLIONS of dollars. That's a huge chunk of change. And that is just another factor clearly separating it from nearly any other used market. The proof is in all the dollars being funneled into middlemen like Gamestop rather than into publishers and developers. The short-sighted commenters arguing with you simply can't see it.

Wow. Such a debate.

First, Rikimaru said, "Do you buy used car every week?" What does that even mean? No, I do not buy a used car every week. I do not buy a used game every week either. A used car is hundreds or thousands times the cost of a game. Do you buy 1,000 used games every week? Ridiculous.

Second, Zippon, DEGRADE, since you like to use capital letters to prove your point, can happen with videogames. They get scratched like a car gets scratched. They can get warped in the sun. You can also keep a car nice as new for decades, but most don't. And I have bought used/discounted games that I would never buy new. That's just a fact. And I've bought games new because I knew they would be worth it to me.

Third. Yes, there are people that buy used even though they could afford to buy a game new. Just like there are people that don't go to a movie theater or buy the Blu-Ray and decide to wait for the rental or watch it on TV. Just like there are those who borrow a book from a library instead of buying every book new. So what? Without people buying new games, there wouldn't be any used games. People are still gonna buy Gears 3, MW3, Skyrim new. People with more money will buy these games new, but for people who don't have money to buy it new, they won't.

Fourth, GrandpaMasaki ... Which games are incomplete? DLC is annoying, but most downloadable content are added levels/story. The Fallout DLC does not take away the main storyline. You can play Batman just fine without Robin or Catwoman as playable characters. GTA, Mafia, Bioshock all are fine to me without the DLC. If they had a game that just stopped before the ending, then that's one thing, but for the most part ... DLC feels like added stuff.

The videogame industry is already a billion dollar industry, but they want more. Of course, they want more. They are corporations. A corporation that doesn't make more money this year than the last is a dying corporation. The thing is, used games aren't damaging the industry to the point where games won't get made. They will still get made because they still will make a huge profit. If they want more money, then they should stop complaining and figure out a way to make more money. If we don't like what they are doing, then we won't buy into it and then they'll have to come up with a new plan.

I buy the majority of my games new. I might not buy all the games at $50-60, but I prefer new copies so that I'm not playing a long game for a couple months and then find out near the end, it crashes due to a scratch that wasn't noticed before. Also, I have never sold any games to any Used videogame store. I still have every game I've ever owned. But, what do I do if I don't want any of these games anymore? Throw them in the trash? No. I'd either give them away or sell them.

What should happen in the future is we pay a monthly fee (like cable) and play as many games we want to play. The percentage of time we play on each game will determine the profit made to each individual developer. (I say developer and not publisher. Publishing is a dying business model for all industries and that's why they are worried.) It could have tiered pricing too. Access to new games will cost more per month. Others who can't afford that will have to wait six months or a year to play them. OnLive is just the beginning. Will it happen everywhere else soon? No. But that's the way other industries are headed ... Netflix/Amazon/Hulu for movies/TV, Spotify/ZunePass for music, Amazon for eBooks. Times are changing.

@ch3burashka Scrooge McDuck's giant money vault! So big you can swim in it

@ch3burashka

"I don't even know what the hell it's from. "

GET OUT

Because there isnt one.most " pure gamers" just have this need to bitch and be elitest. A product no matter the form is a product once purchased it can be sold and resold, but here is one argument...used game sales just like homes & cars, have kept the industry a float. Video games more than most industries have increadible swings based off of economy, saturation and ect. On those many down swings its the pre owned market that keeps driving revenue. As much as it is the supposed bad guy look at gamestop, its been around through EVERY cycle that the game market has crashed....now the are the worlds largest retailer and EVERY major console developer and publishers largest customer/partner in most cases. Pre owned works, for tbe industry and the consumer

@RealityCheck2011

And your mom.